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Technical Help Forum
Started by LarryC at 04-03-2007 7:43 PM. Topic has 33 replies.
  
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 04-03-2007, 7:43 PM
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LarryC
Joined on 02-20-2007
Miami, OK
Posts 11
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Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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I am getting ready to replace the water pump seals, stator and cam chain and tensioner on a 78 cx500. I have the rear cover off and am ready to order the following parts. Is there anything else I should order while in there?
Oil seal(behind water pump) 91202-283-013
O-Ring 94608-50000 2 each
Gasket, Rear Cover 11394-449-306
Dowel Pin(Rear Cover) 94301-10160 2 each
Cap, Valve Adj(not in very good shape) 12361-300-000
Oil Seal(Rear Cover) 91251-zw5-003
Tensioner, Cam Chain 14500-470-751
Guide Set, Cam Chain 14600-415-305
Spring, Tensioner 14515-415-000
O-Ring(6.5x3.1) 91312-415-000
Cam Chain 14401-ma1-013
Water Pump Cover Gasket 11396-415-000
Washer 6MM 90441-706-000
Washer 10MM 90453-415-000
Seal, Mech 19217-611-000
These part numbers are off Service Honda's Fiche.
Thanks for your help. I am really enjoying this site. This bike only has 17k on the clock, and has been pulled apart about 3 years ago. Everything looks real good. My brother bought the bike and the stator went out. I later swapped a 78 GL1000 for this bike and another 80 CX500. I later sold the 80 and am now working on getting the 78 back on the road as a backup for my 76 GL1000.
Larry
78 CX500
76 GL1000
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04-03-2007, 7:52 PM
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DickInRaleigh
 
Joined on 02-26-2006
5405 Thornhill Ct
Posts 469
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![Cool [H]](/cs/emoticons/emotion-11.gif)
Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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Yes but go to
http://www.servicehonda.com/
or
http://www.ronayers.com/index.cfm
for petter prices.
Also use Yamaha p/n 11H-12438-10-00 for the water pump seal. ($12)
The seal will be difficult to install without the tool but it can be done. I clean the bore out and give the leading edge a 45 degree chamfer to help get he seal started.
Dick In Raleigh
<><
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04-04-2007, 4:09 PM
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DaveNearAtlanta
Joined on 03-03-2006
Lawrenceville, GA
Posts 500
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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You may want to consider replacing the front camshaft seal, p/n 91201-415-013 while it's easy to get to. My GL500 had a leak here.
My Home Page
1981 GL500I
1982 GL500I
1983 GL650I
This User ID is no longer used. DaveF is my new User ID.
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04-04-2007, 7:20 PM
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neilage66
Joined on 08-12-2006
Oregon, WI USA
Posts 124
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![Coffee [C]](/cs/emoticons/emotion-44.gif)
Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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So...this is the notorious "triple-bypass" ?
I've heard tell...
Wish I had something to add besides: Best of Luck to You. 
Village of Oregon - USA
1980 Z1R (Zelda)
1981 GPz550 (Rufus)
Motorbike Photos
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04-06-2007, 3:38 PM
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LarryC
Joined on 02-20-2007
Miami, OK
Posts 11
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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One more question about this. I got the stator out. It's definitely shorted to ground. What I'm worried about is the cdi pulser is a mess. I looks intact as far as wiring and such, but it is really filthy and rusty. It looks as if the gasket had been leaking for a good while. That's probably what caused the stator to go. The wiring harness was a mess also. The cdi pulser is 71.93 at Service Honda. How often do they fail? Any idea of the probability of it being bad? Leon says it ran fine as long as he had battery.
Thanks,
Larry
Larry
78 CX500
76 GL1000
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04-06-2007, 4:53 PM
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Shep
Joined on 01-30-2007
Hull.East Yorkshire.England
Posts 2,121
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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 LarryC wrote: | |
One more question about this. I got the stator out. It's definitely shorted to ground. What I'm worried about is the cdi pulser is a mess. I looks intact as far as wiring and such, but it is really filthy and rusty. It looks as if the gasket had been leaking for a good while. That's probably what caused the stator to go. The wiring harness was a mess also. The cdi pulser is 71.93 at Service Honda. How often do they fail? Any idea of the probability of it being bad? Leon says it ran fine as long as he had battery.
Thanks,
Larry
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Can you be more specific?There are 2 pulsar blocks e.g left and right cylinder.I'm no expert in this area but they are AFAIK an encapsualted coil with or without a magnet contained.By this definition they must be very robust as they are electro-mechanical.As there are very few resources I know of that can get new ones you will have to take a chance with them but they are not known for failing even after 27 years.
New Global CX/GL Forum,
http://globalcxglvtwins.hostingdelivered.com/
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04-06-2007, 5:57 PM
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Shep
Joined on 01-30-2007
Hull.East Yorkshire.England
Posts 2,121
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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You mean the Advance and retard Mechanism.I've seem next to no posts about these failing in the four years I've been running my CXs(Gls) so I reckon a clean up will do however I'm pretty good with the old searches so I'd get this just in case if you like,
http://tinyurl.com/37af6b
Cheap as chips/fries as we say over here and why not :)
New Global CX/GL Forum,
http://globalcxglvtwins.hostingdelivered.com/
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04-07-2007, 3:34 PM
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LarryC
Joined on 02-20-2007
Miami, OK
Posts 11
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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Thanks for the link. I bought it. I spent a good part of the day cleaning and scraping off old gaskets getting ready for the parts swap. Sure be glad when they get here.
Thanks again,
Larry
Larry
78 CX500
76 GL1000
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04-21-2007, 2:22 PM
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LarryC
Joined on 02-20-2007
Miami, OK
Posts 11
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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Well, all went very well until I tried to put the new water pump seal in. It flat would not go. It'll never go now. I ruined the seal. I am going to order a new seal and take it to a machine shop and have them put it in, reaming in out a little if they have to. I tried heating the cover to 250 for an hour, freezing the seal, and tried pressing it in. No luck. Wish me luck on the next try. The cam chain and all went very nicely. I rotated the engine several times by hand after putting it on and all seems to be fine.
Larry
78 CX500
76 GL1000
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04-21-2007, 2:45 PM
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Anonymous
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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STOP! Are you aware of the Yamaha seal? They are less expensive than Honda and they press in easier. Part Number: 11H-12438-10-00
Description: SEAL, MECHANICAL
Price: $10.06
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04-21-2007, 6:09 PM
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Shep
Joined on 01-30-2007
Hull.East Yorkshire.England
Posts 2,121
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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04-21-2007, 6:58 PM
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R80Dave
Joined on 03-03-2006
Appleton, WI
Posts 851
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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Are you sure you didn't get a 650 seal for a 500??? They can be a different size.
David in Wisconsin
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04-22-2007, 4:17 PM
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DaveNearAtlanta
Joined on 03-03-2006
Lawrenceville, GA
Posts 500
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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A tip was passed on to me to use some threaded rod, washers and sockets. See
Motorcycle Preparation.
It has worked well for me on several GL500's with no real problem. I've only used the Honda seals.
I think I remember hearing there are some minor differences in the seal opening sizes between various bikes, though. Maybe someone with more information can jump in.
My Home Page
1981 GL500I
1982 GL500I
1983 GL650I
This User ID is no longer used. DaveF is my new User ID.
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04-22-2007, 5:18 PM
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Shep
Joined on 01-30-2007
Hull.East Yorkshire.England
Posts 2,121
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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I'm either going to bring some clarity to this or more confusion.I have stripped for spares several CX engines.I have re-built several CX engines from the crank up.I don't believe that Honda EVER made the Water pump seal orifice anything but standard dimentions e.g they made the hole 1 size.
What I do believe is that somewhere down-the-line someone used a,"Yamaha" seal that needed the hole opening.This has now become almost mythological and therefore been given creedance that has no value.
Also.The Metal part of the Mechanical seal has not failed in any way in all of the engines I've stripped and or re-built.It is an,"Interference-fit" and by definition bonded at a molecular level as close as can be defined without actual melting of the two metals.
I can say say without fear of contradiction that many people,myself included(Only once and lesson learnt) have tried to to replace the Mech seal the official way and suffered failure and frustration.
There is absolutley no need to bother risking the ruining a Mech seal or the back crankcase by doing this.
Just do this!
http://www.geocities.com/sheppola/cx500/mechseal.html
New Global CX/GL Forum,
http://globalcxglvtwins.hostingdelivered.com/
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04-22-2007, 8:45 PM
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Len in PA
Joined on 03-31-2006
Bristol, PA
Posts 232
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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Dave,
That is exactly the way I did it. Seal went right in. Also, if you don't mind, what make/model is that nifty tent you use? Thanx!
Len in PA
'82 GL500i...nearing 100,000 miles
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04-23-2007, 12:35 PM
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Don in Oz
Joined on 03-10-2006
Melbourne, Australia
Posts 329
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Re: Doing the water pump, cam chain and stator
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Well, Shep, the bikes we got in Oz definitely had two different size water-pump seal orifices. The earlier CX500 (Oz standard and Custom) with CDI - from 1978 to 1981 - had the smaller size hole (from memory 27.5mm), and this could be easily seen when looking through the "bore" in the rear casing after the oil seal and the mechanical seal are removed.
The oil seal for ALL CXes and GLs is a 28 mm outer diameter - and I mean ALL. What you see looking down the "bore" is a small step (0.25mm), which is the 0.5mm difference in "bore" diameters.
The later bikes in Oz - the 1982 CX500 standard, 1982 Custom, CX500EC Sport - had the 28 mm hole for the mechanical seal, and when you looked down the "bore" in the rear cover, there was NO step.
For our bikes, this change in bore diameter for the mechanical seal also coincides EXACTLY with the change in Honda part number for the mechanical seal, and with the change from 1981 to 1982 models. It also coincides with the change from manual camchain tensioner to automatic camchain tensioner on our models, and from CDI to transistorised ignition, although there is no logical reason for the "tie-up".
I have yet to research the "bore" diameter for the GL500, as it is a half-way change of the above two alterations, and it occurred between the 1980 and 1981 productions. I also have reason to shortly investigate the size of seal in the CX500 Turbo, as my good turbo has the dreaded weep-hole leak, and turbos are basically a 1981 model (by design), although they were only sold as a 1982 model.
The above-documented differences clearly show why some people are having difficulty inserting a later-model mechanical seal into an earlier model's rear cover.
I believe the Yamaha seal being bought by people is only made in one size, and that it is only suitable for the 28mm bore in the rear cover. This does not preclude some previous owners having had the rear cover of an earlier model bored out to 28mm.
Perhaps the best approach - if you HAVE to remove the metal tank, and totally replace the seal unit - is to remove it FIRST, measure the hole, and then order the replacement.
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04-24-2007, 11:53 PM
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