Honda CX500 & GL500 Forum

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03-31-2008, 7:58 PM instructorpilot Joined on 12-15-2007 Orlando FL Posts 214 My Rant I am so tired of China. Now, I am not normally a basher, and I know that it is not China's fault, But when I go to a store to buy new boots, and they say Harley Davidson I expect them to be made in the USA. I went to look at a new hutch for all of my spouses' crystal, and they are all made in China. Have we become so anamored with the absolute lowest cost that we have lost our soul.......I asked the lady that I wanted to buy something nice and she showed me a $3500 dollar case. It is made in China. I want a choice. They make our clothes, our electronics, our food, and now our fine furniture. North Carolina used to be where all the fine furniture came from, not anymore. They hold most of our debt, what happens to us when that bill comes due. I want out...I went to the Red Wing Shoe store and found what I was looking for, made in Minnasota, for the same price as the Harley shoes. I would much rather support our fellow citizens in Minnasota than the Chinese. Ever wonder where our vintage bikes come from, They were bought by working Americans. Look at all the bikes that come from the North East or the Midwest. These people could buy these bikes because they could afford them. Thats because they had well paying manufacturing Jobs back in the day. If I want to buy low cost stuff made in China then I'll go to Wal Mart. At least their honest as to where their stuff comes from and why. I guess what I'm saying is that I want is a choice. Genuine Harley freekin' Davidson stuff made in China. Sad. We've sold our soals for profit. Ok, I'm done Al aka instructorpilot 2 CB350F's, 1 CX500, 1 GL500, CB750F, XV500, 2 GL1100's, DL1000    Report

03-31-2008, 8:36 PM Cobram Joined on 06-23-2007 Boston, MA Posts 631 Re: My Rant  instructorpilot wrote: Ever wonder where our vintage bikes come from, They were bought by working Americans. Look at all the bikes that come from the North East or the Midwest. These people could buy these bikes because they could afford them. I hope you see the irony in your post.  Japan...China....same thing.  The reason they could afford Jap bikes back in the day is because they were quality goods, at a decent price.  American bikes were overpriced GARBAGE.  Maybe I'm older, but I still remember the Jap bashing days, where the UAW would BUY a Jap car or bike, then smash it with a sledge hammer in triumph.  That showed them. Don't lose hope, the low dollar is bringing many a job back to the USA.  Another Irony among Ironies, these jobs are being brought here by foreign manufacturers, while American manufacturers are moving overseas. A Modern Parable   A Japanese company (Toyota) and an American company (General Motors) decided to have a canoe race on the Missouri River . Both teams practiced long and hard to reach their peak performance before the race. On the big day, the Japanese won by a mile. The Americans, very discouraged and depressed, decided to investigate the reason for the crushing defeat. A management team made up of senior management was formed to investigate and recommend appropriate action. Their conclusion was the Japanese had 8 people rowing and 1 person steering, while the American team had 8 people steering and 1 person rowing. Feeling a deeper study was in order, American management hired a consulting company and paid them a large amount of money for a second opinion. They advised, of course, that too many people were steering the boat, while not enough people were r owing. Not sure of how to utilize that information, but wanting to prevent another loss to the Japanese, the rowing team's management structure was totally reorganized to 4 steering supervisors, 3 area steering superintendents and 1 assistant superintendent steering manager. They also implemented a new performance system that would give the 1 person rowing the boat greater incentive to work harder. It was called the 'Rowing Team Quality First Program,' with meetings, dinners and free pens and a certificate of completion for the rower. There was discussion of getting new paddles, canoes and other equipment, extra vacation days for practices and bonuses. The next year the Japanese won by two miles. Humiliated, the American management laid off the rower (a reduction in workforce) for poor performance, halted development of a new canoe, sold the paddles, and canceled all capital investments for new equipment. The money saved was distributed to the Senior Executive s as bonuses and the next year's racing team was "out-sourced" to India . .. Sadly, the End. However, sad, but oh so true! Here's something else to think about: Ford has spent the last thirty years moving all its factories out of the US, claiming they can't make money paying American wages. Toyota has spent the last thirty years building more than a dozen plants inside the US . The last quarter's results: Toyota makes 4 billion in profits while Ford racked up 9 billion in losses. Ford folks are still scratching their heads. 1978 CX500 - I live on a one-way street that's also a dead end. I'm not sure how I got here, or how I'm going to get out.    Report

03-31-2008, 10:18 PM George in Indiana Joined on 03-03-2006 Posts 344 Re: My Rant It's getting harder to escape the China junk. At least most stores used to give you a choice but not anymore. Last week I needed a new bar and chain for my chainsaw. Had some Home Depot gift certificates so I stopped by there. They had a total of ONE brand of chain to choose from...and it was made in China. On my way to the checkout I pictured having to sharpen the damn thing after each tank of gas or worse yet having it grenade. Threw it back on the shelf and left the store. I headed over to TSC which is where I should have gone in the first place. Got my made in USA bar/chain combo and it was only $10 bucks more than the China crap. TSC still has China stuff but it seems they try a bit harder than most to offer USA made items. CX500 TURBO CX650 TURBO '86 Honda Elite 150 Deluxe '04 GSX1300R Hayabusa    Report

04-01-2008, 5:48 AM instructorpilot Joined on 12-15-2007 Orlando FL Posts 214 Re: My Rant Thanks Cobram for that peice of reality. As I said in my post I am not a basher but after seeing what I percieved as quality brands, with the quality enhanced price tags I decided not to pay the inflated prices and just go to Target or Wal-Mart. The clothes are probibly manufactored next to each other in the same factory and each company is allowed it's turn on the label maker. I guess I made my choice by not paying the inflated prices. It's interesting to note that every none American based company that manufactores here has found out what donestic companies seem to miss. American workers are the best in the world, it's American Management that sucks. 2 CB350F's, 1 CX500, 1 GL500, CB750F, XV500, 2 GL1100's, DL1000    Report

04-25-2008, 9:28 AM Markmakeitso Joined on 09-08-2007 Mankato MN Posts 34 Re: My Rant Red Wing does make very good stuff, although I recall a bike mag test from a couple months back that noticed a particular model was manufactured in China. I'll have to go back and doublecheck. When the government's economic stimulus checks come in a couple months I swear not one dollar of mine will go towards Chinese items. While they do finally make good parts (along with the terrible stuff they mastered awhile ago) I really don't mind paying a bit extra for made in the US.    Report

04-25-2008, 10:04 AM Exothermia Joined on 04-18-2008 Posts 116 Re: My Rant There is a bit of irony to this since we do ride Japanese bikes, but there is a difference. Japan's motor industry has become like the US's, or Germany's - world reknowned for quality and durability. China is just cheap labor and cheap products. We don't ride Hondas because they're the cheapest junk money can buy, we ride them because they're good machines. Practically nothing China makes can offer that. I think that will change though. There was a time when Japan was cheap labor and cheap products. In a way, us buying their products helped modernize their industry and brought them to the higher standards of workmanship that they make today, just as we did in our own country after the great depression by buying our own goods. Now the same thing is happening in China. The problem is, China is huge, and China is not the USA. By pumping all our money into their economy, we are making our own country poorer and it's just going to take too long to make China a country that makes quality goods. It will probably happen one day, but it's going to cost us a lot and it already has.    Report

04-26-2008, 6:02 AM Anonymous Re: My Rant  The sad reality is that much of the stuff made in Chine is every bit as good as stuff made anywhere else in the world..... why, because we have sold our souls, as well as manufacturing equipment/processes to the devil. Ironically, if you look at where  Japanese branded merchandise is made.......yup, you guessed it  - China. They somehow manage to ship the raw materials to China, build the item, then ship the finished product back for cheaper than industrialists here are willing to make the product for....all that in the face of high transportation costs due to the high cost of oil.  That should tell you whose interests are being served......  they certainly do not care about the american worker or the US in general..... to them it is just a giant pool of suckers to extract money from. J.T.

09-04-2008, 7:38 PM motormatt Joined on 08-27-2008 portland, Or Posts 78 Re: My Rant the worst of it is when you do find something that says made in america it still could have been made somewhere else...all a company has to do it put the final touches on a product, bacialy their logo, for it to be made in america...Nike for along time was doing that. they would have completly manufactured shoes made, but the Nike swoosh wasn't sewed on. they would sew that on here in the states and it was "made in america" 1980 cx500D 1978 yamaha xs400 (bobber project) who needs a speedo, the cop will tell you how fast you're going    Report

09-04-2008, 8:05 PM chicagorandy Joined on 05-28-2007 Chicago, IL Posts 173 Re: My Rant And just to make you feel even "better", as I type this I am holding one of my Red Wing work boots, stock # 1225.......Made in China. 2003 Ural Tourist - 76,5000kms to date 1982 Honda GL500 Interstate 8220 miles since 05/30/07 "Down the highway of life at smiles per hour"    Report

09-04-2008, 8:22 PM CXSarnia Joined on 01-11-2008 Sarnia, Ontario, Canada Posts 298 Re: My Rant I can appreaciate the rant - against off shore products.  But, where does the blame belong.  I can't blame the Chinese.  They are providing a service for what is demanded.  Quality at cheap prices.  - Yes, I said quality.  Case in point some runners (braket with roller on it) for a patio screen door I bought stamped "made in USA" fell apart in my hand before they were even installed.  The Chinese replacements are in place and have been working wonderfully for 5 years.  Somewhere over the past 2 or 3 decades, the quality of U.S. parts - whether it be Automotive, or household hardware - had deteriorated.  Remember the ad "quality is job one" brought to you by Ford - The only Ford I owned (Mercury actually) went through three motors by the time it hit 100,000 km (thats about 62,000 miles!)  Motors I said.  The biggest, albeit the most expensive part of the car!!!!    My Jap Crap bike - bought in 1982 cleared 120,000 km in only 8 years with nothing more than new tires - lots of tires it seemed.  26 years later, With about 139,000 km I was looking at the triple bipass.  It was never done, and the only indicator was a bit of oil in the coolant.  I'm not hesitating to install a new engine in it, because I know it will last me till I'm no longer able to ride! Now, lets look at what is good about off shore.  We are all here because we are riding 20 to 30 - something year old motorcycles.  From Japan.  Remember back in the 70's with the chants Japanese Junk - rice burners.. I can't remember all the taunts I got from people riding western technology (speaking not only of Harly, but of triumph, and others) - Do you remember "keep the shiny side up" That referred to the Harley Davidson directly.  It seems that after a number of miles, the bottom of their bikes were covered in oil.  Even today, I came in from working on my 26 year old Honda, walked into the kitchen to wash up before dinner, and noticed only a small amount of dust on my hands.  I've never had to clean up oil unless I had to crack open a cylinder head or something.  Somebody else mentioned the Nike issue of affixing the lables on foreign made shoes, then calling it 'made in USA'.  Here in Canada we have finally come to the realization that produce actually made off shore, but bottled in Canada - is not Made In Canada.  It was a bit of a joke when a can of pinapples was labled "made in Canada" - as Canada has no tropical area to grow pinapple - so now there is a rule about "contents" versus the canning process etc.   Once again, Who is to blame.  He who wants to make money will falsely advertize to sell the product to the most consumers.  1979 CX500 Deluxe http://groups.google.com/group/cx500-deluxe-restoration-page 1982 CB750K Daily rider 1999 Sept 1982 CX500 Custom - project Originally bought 1982 April reacquired 2006 April http://groups.google.ca/group/cx500-restoration-page    Report

09-04-2008, 8:49 PM makenzie71 Joined on 03-30-2007 TX Posts 499 Re: My Rant We'll never get out of it because we were brought up and founded as a capitalist society.  We're better than everyone else out there.  That's why I won't take $7.25/hr to haul garbage.  I'm too good for that $7.25/hr.  Some wetback can do it. Capitalist societies always fail.  Period.  We've only made it this far by being able to effectively convince the rest of the world that we're better than they are. Available from EssGlass ATV/Motorcycle Fabrication ~Preload adjusters (CX5/applicable): $55 + core caps ~310mm big brake kits (CX5/applicable): starting at $125 ~Left exit divorced exhaust: $225 for info email me!    Report

09-04-2008, 9:05 PM Randall-in-Mpls Joined on 07-06-2007 Minneapolis, MN Posts 1,113 Re: My Rant  makenzie71 wrote: Capitalist societies always fail.  Period. As opposed to all those thriving communist economies around the world.  The problem isn't capitalism.  It's materialism, the basis of both Marxism and Madison Avenue. R '78 CX500 - The Black Maggot My mid-life crisis has two wheels. CX500 Factory Service Manual (Downloadable by chapter)    Report

09-04-2008, 9:14 PM makenzie71 Joined on 03-30-2007 TX Posts 499 Re: My Rant Communistic societies have been thriving since the beginning of man...of wait, you must be thinking of modern nations like Russia and China which are labeled "communists" when in fact they have never been anything even remotely resembling communistic...in that case you're right.  Communistic societies fail, too. Available from EssGlass ATV/Motorcycle Fabrication ~Preload adjusters (CX5/applicable): $55 + core caps ~310mm big brake kits (CX5/applicable): starting at $125 ~Left exit divorced exhaust: $225 for info email me!    Report

09-04-2008, 9:20 PM Blindstitch2002 Joined on 05-16-2007 Greenfield Wisconsin Posts 1,708 Re: My Rant I got one to beat all you guys. I went to a pow wow last year and I was looking through the vendors stuff. I ran across one table that had a lot of dream catchers and animal horns. I came across a rattle made of a turtle shell and some wood. It was a full turtle shell minus the turtle and I flipped it over to see a made in china sticker. How the hell do native americans find made in china american turtle shells to sell at a traditional pow wow. Is a chinesse turtle worth more than an american turtle. 1979 Honda Cx500 Custom    Report

09-04-2008, 11:08 PM TwoW4B2C4V Joined on 11-15-2007 Posts 386 Re: My Rant  makenzie71 wrote: Communistic societies have been thriving since the beginning of man... With all due offense, that is the most moronic thing I've seen in a long time.  Would you like to cite an example or two?  Vegetating and thriving are two very different things, BTW.  Having worked, lived and studied all over the world, I'll take the capitalist model, thank you.  Evidently you do too, otherwise you'd be anywhere but TeHas as you write this drivel.  Kumbahya baby, yeah, that'll fill the ole stomach.  Get back to us when you get some real life experience. Please reply if you don't get this message.    Report

09-05-2008, 3:48 AM makenzie71 Joined on 03-30-2007 TX Posts 499 Re: My Rant Let's try "Zulu" for starters. Before you start throwing out inflammatory comments about someone's "life experience" maybe you should step back and examine whether or not they're the ones bitching about how hard it is; or possibly, just maybe, whether you have any clue at all about their life.  Also, just for the sake of maintaining the spirit of capitalist superiority and to end my contribution to this topic as an ass, there's no "H" in "Kumbaya".  Get back to us when you learn how to use spell-check. Available from EssGlass ATV/Motorcycle Fabrication ~Preload adjusters (CX5/applicable): $55 + core caps ~310mm big brake kits (CX5/applicable): starting at $125 ~Left exit divorced exhaust: $225 for info email me!    Report

09-05-2008, 4:16 AM Ookie Wonderslug Joined on 05-04-2008 Unionville, NC Posts 124 Re: My Rant All civilizations fail. Doesn't matter if they are capitalist or not. There are always stages they go through. It has nothing to do with the economic system. It's a corruption issue. Any way of running a society is pretty much as good as any other as long as the people running it are not corrupt. But as the corruption grows the system breaks down and becomes untenable. At that point there is a revolution and a new system is set up and it runs well for a time. Because the people that run it remember what happened to the last guys and are honest. After a while people are born that don't remember and the corruption starts. It's a cycle and it has nothing to do with the type of system. It's the people in it. 1982 CX500C "Twisted"    Report

09-05-2008, 11:28 AM TwoW4B2C4V Joined on 11-15-2007 Posts 386 Re: My Rant  makenzie71 wrote: Let's try "Zulu" for starters. Also, just for the sake of maintaining the spirit of capitalist superiority and to end my contribution to this topic as an ass, there's no "H" in "Kumbaya".  Get back to us when you learn how to use spell-check.   "Zulu"??? Are you kidding, this is your example???  Get your basics straight, or does communism now encompass Kings, clans and tribes within the same entity, right of succession to Royalty because of birthright??? This is your example?   The theories are wonderful and beautiful, everyone holding hands and singing Kumbaya (no typo this time, happy joy joy, that shows me) but reality and human nature has a way of kicking pie in the sky, milk and honey for all dreams down the toilet.    I visited the Durban airport project about a year ago;  seems they're doing everything they can to get those evil capitalist rands.  When it's ready, maybe you can fly down there and wander off in the woods to form this idyllic communist society of yours, just don't forget the Kool Aide.   "If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart.  If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain." author unknown Anyone else having quoting problems with the FireFox update?  It's been adding gibberish microsucks code to some posts. Please reply if you don't get this message.    Report

09-07-2008, 5:34 PM tntchitwood Joined on 03-02-2008 Pine Knot, KY Posts 509 Re: My Rant My .02.............. I have never heard of any American Refugees climbing on anything that floats trying to get to Cuba. Don't get me started Mak..........Just sit back and continue to enjoy the freedom that me and some of my military associates have given you, we have given more than you will ever know. The ZULU!? HA! Tom '82 Silverwing Chopper '02 750 Shadow http://choppercharles.com/cs/forums/29599/ShowPost.aspx    Report

09-08-2008, 9:29 PM Cobram Joined on 06-23-2007 Boston, MA Posts 631 Re: My Rant Amen, Bro. Tom, amen. 1978 CX500 - I live on a one-way street that's also a dead end. I'm not sure how I got here, or how I'm going to get out.    Report